This is fairly long, so I cut it. 🙂 Or I put it behind a cut, something like that.
Boundaries.
(When I quote something I am quoting Boundaries: Where you end and I begin by Anne Katherine)
“A boundary is a limit or edge that defines you as separate from others. A boundary is a limit that promotes integrity.”
Hm. Integrity: in·teg·ri·ty ( P ) Pronunciation Key (n-tgr-t)
n.
Steadfast adherence to a strict moral or ethical code.
The state of being unimpaired; soundness.
The quality or condition of being whole or undivided; completeness.
Completeness, soundness… Ok. I can buy that.
“Boundaries come in assorted shapes and sizes. They can be rigid like a brick wall or as flexible as a plastic bag, as impenetrable as a lead shield or as permeable as a chain-link fence. Some boundaries are transparent, others are opaque. Boundaries can be so far out that people can hardly get within yelling distance. Or they can be so close that in the words of Grouch Marx, ‘If I were any closer, I’d be in back of you.'”
This sounds to me like it isn’t a big deal that I don’t necessarily have boundaries where other people do. If I am ok with people being closer to me than some people are it isn’t a big deal.
“Intrusion violations are when physical or emotional boundary are breached… incest…inappropriate personal questions, inappropriate touching, and attempting to control how another thinks, believes, or feels. Appropriate closeness is defined by context, by the type of relationship. … Distance violations: when intimacy is less than what is appropriate to a relationship.”
I feel when intrusions happen. I am not always very good at defending myself. This is something I am working on consciously. At the DHP a few times boundary issues came up. Once when I had a “lets be friend” conversation with a friend–I really like him as a person and I am really glad that I was able to state what I wanted from the relationship. I am proud of myself. That is a conversation I am piss poor at having. Since the conversation, I find that it is easier for me to talk to this person; I feel a lot more comfortable with knowing that there are boundaries in place. I choose to seek him out now. It is good. I also had a few people touch me in ways I wasn’t comfortable with. I tried to simply move away from the touch and when that didn’t work, I would ask people stop. This was really hard with Tom because he likes to push my boundaries in public and I think that I should actually create more space there for both of our sakes. It is an issue. When I finally reached my limit of feeling as if I was getting too much attention that I didn’t really want, I changed my clothes and I felt more anonymous again. I was ok with this as a resolution. I dealt with the situation in the way I needed to in order to feel safe again. That is ok with me. If someone pulls away from me when I expect closeness, I freak out. This is far worse for me psychologically than intrusions. This is part of the reason it is so hard for me to ask for emotional attention when I need it. I am afraid that someone will tell me “no” and then I will feel like they aren’t meeting my emotional needs and I would rather not ask than be disappointed.
“Enmeshment is not intimacy.”
Tom and I actually did this for quite some time. It was bad. Recognizing that we were doing this (ok, mostly I was doing it) was probably the most positive thing we got from seeing the therapist. I think realizing that this was happening in our relationship (enmeshment) was a big step towards me starting to go dancing by myself. I need to have things that I do on my own. Ok, then dancing led to poly and I’m not yet ready to examine if I am trading enmeshment with one person with serial enmeshment. I don’t think that is what I am doing, but I could be lying to myself and I’m not ready to figure that out yet. I will be eventually.
The author talks for a while about how sex is inappropriate outside of strictly deep emotional relationships, which I don’t agree with so I won’t quote that. I think sex that is between friends, is perfectly acceptable and healthy provided that people negotiate and are respected for what they bring to the table.
“Unfortunately, many of us have been in situations where we’ve been overpowered physically, where someone has used violence or power to take from us. We are not responsible for that harm. An unfortunate consequence of such violence or abuse of power is that we sometimes believe we are born to be victims. We let other commit even nonviolent offenses against us because we’ve lost the sense (or maybe we never had it to begin with) that we have the right to defend out boundaries….If a child is abused for his natural response (saying ‘no’ to negative stimuli), he quickly learns to squelch it. We are naturally inclined to defend ourselves from harm and we must be frightened into accepting harm. If, as children, we learn to accept harm, as adults we see harm to ourselves as the way of the world. It’s the way things are. We bear it and go on anyways.”
I think this is where I was for several years of my adolescence. It is why so many bad things happened to me seemingly all at once. I’m not a victim. I’m not just a broken person. I need to believe that I can effect what happens to me.
“When you protect yourself from even mild physical violation, a powerful message is sent through your body. I am me! I am strong! I am valuable! I can keep myself safe. When you protect yourself, you empower yourself.”
I’m seriously working on this one. Very seriously. The “I am valuable” message is the hardest for me to internalize.
“Emotional boundaries define the self. Assaults to boundaries threaten the self. One’s unique self is composed of a complex of ideas, feelings, values, wishes, and perspectives that are duplicated by no other. Emotional boundaries protect this complex.
What strengthens emotional boundaries? The right to say no. The freedom to say yes. Respect for feelings. Support for our personal process. Acceptance of differences. Enhancement of our uniqueness. Permission for expression.
What harms emotional boundaries? Ridicule. Contempt. Derision. Sarcasm. Mockery. Scorn. Belittling comments. Stifling communication. Insistence on conformity. Arbitrariness. The need to overpower. Heavy judgments. Any kind of abuse. Abandonment. Threat. Insecurity.”
I’m spending a lot of time and energy trying to believe I have the right to say no. I was talking with a woman I know very casually last night and she asked me how things have been in my life lately. I told her very briefly that I am exploring poly and that I think it is very good for me. She told me that poly destroyed everything good about her and that it is the most horrible thing in the world. I countered that I believe poly is helping me work on who I am as a person in a positive way. For example: boundaries. And that it is something I need to do anyway. She told me that I have the strongest boundaries of anyone she has ever seen. That “no” is my favorite word and that I have no problem throwing people away when I am done with them so she doesn’t see how it could possibly be healthy for me to get better at doing so. I feel she is wrong; it is entirely possible I just deluding myself. In the moment, though, this line of commentary felt very harsh, negative, judgmental, and generally it felt like a pretty nasty sort of opinion for her to be expressing. So I told her that I didn’t feel like she was being in any way complimentary, that I don’t agree with her assessment, and thanks for your time but I am leaving this conversation now. It was a hard and uncomfortable thing for me to do, but I’m proud of myself.
Sometimes I wonder if I am equally as abrasive in telling other people how I view them? Do I hurt people like that? I bloody hope not. Hopefully this conversation will encourage me to think before I speak more when comments are not helpful and could be hurtful.
“Here are some ways you can deny your true self and waken your emotional boundaries:
Pretending to agree when you disagree: “I love that color.” (You really hate that color.)
Concealing your true feelings: “I wasn’t hurt.” (You were terribly hurt.)
Going along with an activity that you really don’t want to do and never stating your preference: “”That movie is fine with me.” (You’d rather take a walk.)
Declining to join an activity you really want to do: “No thanks, you guys go ahead.” (You’re aching to belong.)
Pushing yourself beyond your limits
Working too hard
Working too long
Doing too much for others
Not resting when tired
Ignoring your needs
Not eating regular, healthy meals
Insufficient sleep
Too little or too much alone time
Too much or too little exercise
Insufficient contact with people who truly care about you
Insufficient or too many leisure activities
Using chemicals to avoid yourself: nicotine, alcohol, caffeine, sugar, pills, drugs
Using compulsions to avoid yourself: eating, starving, exercise, work, shopping, spending, TV, sex, games, sports–all can be done compulsively
If you are painfully familiar with these examples, I’ll bet a quarter that you learned to sacrifice your true opinions to survive some unhealthiness in your original family.”
I do many of these things. I’m working on it. Nothing is over-night though.
“Boundaries can be so close that you are nose to nose with everyone you meet. If you think you have to answer any question put to you, if you think your thoughts and feelings should be revealed to anyone, your boundaries are too close.
You have a right to privacy. You choose what thoughts and feelings you want to share with whom. No one has a right to information you want to keep to yourself. If someone asks an intrusive question, you don’t have to pay the penalty for her lack of sensitivity.”
This is a somewhat muddy one for me personally. I don’t feel any inhibition about talking about myself. Does that mean my personal boundaries are unhealthy? When I am asked a question I don’t feel comfortable with–I don’t answer. Is that enough? Ultimately I am the only one who can decide this for myself and the jury is still out.
“A person whose boundaries are too flexible may feel overwhelmed with life. Each new demand distracts him. He has difficulty setting priorities and following them. He gets started on one thing only to get sidetracked by something else. He may appear disorganized.”
Whereas I probably don’t seem disorganized, this is something I am seriously working on fixing. Trying to please everyone no matter what doesn’t work and it isn’t healthy. I’m trying to figure out what balance of pleasing and pleasing me is manageable. I think I have made progress. Maybe I am just deluding myself.
“So what’s the goal of a person who wants to be healthy? To form boundaries that have some flexibility and some definite limits, boundaries that move appropriately in response to situations–out for strangers, in for intimates. Boundaries should be distinct enough to preserve our individuality yet open enough to admit new ideas and perspectives. They should be firm enough to keep our values and priorities clear, open enough to communicate our priorities to the right people, yet closed enough to withstand assault from the thoughtless and the mean.”
Preserving my individuality is something that I’m pondering a lot right now. I have been told recently that my lack of boundaries makes people uncomfortable and that is a bad thing. Well, I recognize that I should try to be respectful of other peoples limits and I do mostly try to do so, but I do fuck up at times. Other than not stepping on things that make other people seriously uncomfortable, is it actually important for me to try to erect more boundaries or make my boundaries firmer than I am naturally inclined? I’m not sure. I think a lot of this comes down to the fact that not everyone is going to like me, and I’m ok with that. I don’t think I am willing to compromise parts of who I am in order to be more “socially acceptable.” Amusingly, I was told yesterday that people don’t dislike me. That even though I occasionally “too much” for someone they don’t ever actually dislike me. I am honest and it is hard to hate someone for their honesty. Interesting.
“How to build boundaries:
Increase your self-awareness.
Identify childhood violations and the offenders, feel about them, and get care for that damage.
Examine the state of your boundaries in your present relationships and clean them up.”
I’m working on this slowly. It is quite interesting for me to see that a lot of my boundaries simply don’t exist where other people have them and I am trying to evaluate that.
In examining boundaries with dependants:
“Look at your interactions with your children, your subordinates at work, or clients, or any other people in your care. Are you acting as a peer in any of these relationships?”
This is one I have seriously taken to heart. I am trying like mad to keep things more distant between myself and children at this point. I recognize that I haven’t had good examples of this in my own life and trying to do this from scratch is quite tricky.
“Examine relationships with peers. Sticky situations can appear from:
Employing a friend
Selling a service or an item to a friend
Buying a service or item from a friend
A close relationship with both partners of a marriage. If you share confidences with both of them, can you trust one to keep what you say from the other? If one shares a confidence that would hurt the other, what do you do?”
Also difficult stuff to deal with. I’m working on it.
Bravo!
One of the things I love about you… you may have had a life that I look at and say “there but for the grace of G-d go I” and it may have impacted you in ways that were distructive, and created ramifications that persist in your present state of being…. but damn it girl, you are no WOOSE! You are increadibly strong and willing to look long and hard at yourself in order to improve yourself and undo that which was done on to you without you agreement, and thats something most folks would rather kill than have to do.
BRAVO!
thanks for sharing this. it was really insightful. I feel like I have a lot to say about a lot of this, but I’m going to restrain myself to only replying to the bit on which my thoughts are most fully processed and clear…
I told her very briefly that I am exploring poly and that I think it is very good for me. She told me that poly destroyed everything good about her and that it is the most horrible thing in the world.
That’s very interesting. I explored poly myself for about 4 years and I feel like it ABSOLUTELY did good things for me, even though I ultimately decided that I am not suited for that kind of lifestyle. I learned TONS about myself and how I relate to other people, what I need out of a partner, and what I need to do for myself. It strikes me that if it was THAT damaging to her then she probably wasn’t approaching it in a very healthy way in the first place. But since I have no idea who you’re even talking about, let alone what her approach was, I can’t really judge.
For example: boundaries. And that it is something I need to do anyway. She told me that I have the strongest boundaries of anyone she has ever seen. That “no” is my favorite word and that I have no problem throwing people away when I am done with them so she doesn’t see how it could possibly be healthy for me to get better at doing so. I feel she is wrong; it is entirely possible I just deluding myself. In the moment, though, this line of commentary felt very harsh, negative, judgmental, and generally it felt like a pretty nasty sort of opinion for her to be expressing.
I agree with you. Exploring how to defend your boundaries is totally a healthy thing to do. I don’t think that being better at defending your boundaries is synonymous with being more forceful. I expect that further exploration of the concept of “no” will actually allow you to learn LESS forceful ways to express it that are still effective. As an example, I was in a situation recently with you present where I expressed a rather forceful “no” to someone. Looking back on that situation, if I had expressed my boundaries better up-front that forceful “no” would never have been necessary. I think that would have been a better solution… but hindsight and 20-20 and all that…
So I told her that I didn’t feel like she was being in any way complimentary, that I don’t agree with her assessment, and thanks for your time but I am leaving this conversation now. It was a hard and uncomfortable thing for me to do, but I’m proud of myself.
I think that was a very good reaction. It’s possible that you could have come to some kind of agreement with further discussion and it might have helped her see more clearly, but I doubt it would have helped YOU any and you are not responsible for her enlightenment.
Well, basically she is someone I am not close to and I have no desire to be close to. I don’t think she is a nice person. Whereas I have no problem with people being a wee bit rough around the edges, being a not-nice person is a different thing to me.
She told me that poly destroyed everything good about her and that it is the most horrible thing in the world.
This reminds me of people who claim that drugs destroyed them, or unsettled them, or wrecked their sanity. No. Drugs can’t destroy any part of your personality that isn’t already in a precarious position. Similarly, no philosophy or voluntary behavior can destroy you, polyamory included.
However, if she were in a bad position she set herself up in, she could have used polyamory (intentionally or not) to push herself over that edge.
Beware of people who claim a particular philosophy or behavior has scarred them permanently. What they mean is almost always that one of its practitioners (possibly themself) has permanently scarred them, which is an entirely different thing.
She told me that I have the strongest boundaries of anyone she has ever seen. That “no” is my favorite word and that I have no problem throwing people away when I am done with them so she doesn’t see how it could possibly be healthy for me to get better at doing so.
She has obviously seen you in totally different circumstances than I have, because this is utterly wrong and ass-backwards from what I know of you.
Boundaires is such a fascinating topic. One of my recent LJ topics, the long post about Beltane was laregly about boundaries, and discussing them.
Personally, I’m all for direct open conversation- but its still such a complex topic.
Ok, back to the books. I’m normally not this prolific with my posting but when you are trying to procastinate from school work…
Wow. I am continualy amazed by you. I admire the energy you put into understanding you and the way things work and how to make things better for you and everyone you come in contact with. Then you act on that understanding in the most responsible ways. Kudos. You are a very beautiful person.